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Brian's avatar

In the Old Testament, when the people choose idolatry, the Lord hands them over to wicked kings. The wicked kings reveal the righteousness of God, because they force the people to choose.

God has handed us over to our current situation because we have preferred idols to Him. We have sacrificed at an altar of consumerism, political messianism, self-righteousness, and ideology. We’ve compromised our principles thinking the end justifies the means.

We must therefore have the courage to be hometown prophets, and to speak unpleasant truths not only to the other side, but to ourselves, lest in our arrogance we become ourselves what we oppose in others.

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Elissa L.'s avatar

Are you not aware that a brain-dead woman in Georgia has literally been dehumanized to the point of being used as a human incubator because of the laws you endorse? Dogs are literally treated better than this. Are you not aware that the maternal mortality has risen 62% in Texas as a direct result of the abortion ban? Why doesn't the woman's life matter? This isn't pro-life. It's pro-subjecting women to objectification, torture, and abuse. When you push for laws that treat women as disposable objects and second-class citizens rather than people, in addition to politicians who have been found liable of sexually abusing women (and who have bragged about it on tape), it's no surprise that people will assume you're a misogynist, in addition to Trump and his supporters. Why do Trump supporters (like Matt Walsh and Charlie Kirk -- both of whom run literal hate groups, according to the Southern Poverty Law Center) feel it's just to tell men that they can become anything they dream of, but then tell women that all they can ever be are maids and servants to their husbands who must have endless children and can never leave the home, regardless of whether they want that path or not? If you truly believe in freedom, everyone should have the freedom to choose their own path in life. By supporting these ideas, you ARE supporting misogyny, and to imply this is a Catholic value is incredibly disturbing and dark. We are not your (or Trump's) baby machines, objects, or slaves to control and use however you wish. And the fact that you mockingly refer to women as "oppressed" in quotes when we are literally being reduced and dehumanized to nothing but incubators (and you're the one cheering it on ) is horrific.

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Live IT Today's avatar

The claim that a brain-dead woman in Georgia was “dehumanized” as a “human incubator” deserves clarity. In rare cases like this, families and medical professionals face excruciating decisions. Often, the woman’s previously expressed wishes, the family’s input, and the viability of the child all factor into the choice to sustain life support. This isn’t about using women as objects. It’s about the dignity of both lives involved, especially if the unborn child has reached a stage where survival is possible.

Catholic teaching holds that both the woman and the child are human beings with equal dignity. It never teaches that one life must be sacrificed for the other. When tragic circumstances arise, like brain death, every effort should be made to respect the wishes of the woman, preserve life if possible, and never reduce a person to an object.

The claim that maternal mortality rose 62% in Texas because of the abortion ban is highly misleading and unsupported by rigorous analysis. That number often comes from a 2022 CDC report comparing 2018–2020 to 2021–2022—before Texas’s most restrictive laws took effect post-Dobbs in mid-2022. Many factors contributed to rising maternal mortality nationally, including COVID-19, healthcare disparities, and poverty. States with liberal abortion laws also saw increases.

If Texas is failing women, the solution is not to increase access to abortion but to improve maternal healthcare and support. A truly pro-life ethic demands we care for both mother and child.

Catholicism absolutely affirms that a woman’s life matters. In cases like ectopic pregnancy or other life-threatening conditions, Catholic moral theology permits medical interventions that may indirectly result in the child’s death. The principle is clear: never directly intend to kill, but act to save life wherever possible. This is not hypocrisy—it’s a consistent ethic of life.

True freedom, in the Catholic view, is not doing whatever one wants, but the ability to choose what is right. No one has the freedom to take an innocent life. That’s not oppression—it’s justice. Human rights apply to all human beings, including those not yet born.

Calling pro-life beliefs misogyny is both inaccurate and unjust. Catholicism honors women not as objects or vessels, but as life-givers and equals. Women are not confined to the home by Church teaching. Rather, Catholic tradition uplifts women as leaders, scholars, saints, and creators of culture—Saints like Edith Stein, Teresa of Avila, and Catherine of Siena are testament to that.

Regarding Trump and other political figures: supporting a candidate’s policies does not mean endorsing their every moral failure. Catholics must prudentially weigh outcomes and moral gravity. Abortion ends nearly a million innocent lives a year. That’s a weightier concern than a candidate’s personal flaws, however real and offensive they may be.

The Southern Poverty Law Center is not a neutral authority. It has labeled mainstream Christian organizations as hate groups for affirming marriage and biological reality. Disagreeing with gender ideology or upholding sexual ethics is not hate. It’s a legitimate worldview grounded in natural law and reason.

The Catholic Church teaches the equal, inviolable dignity of every person—man, woman, born, and unborn. It affirms the sanctity of motherhood, the importance of fatherhood, and the universal call to love and self-gift. No one is disposable. No one is merely an object. We are not the authors of life, but its stewards.

A society that truly values women supports them with better healthcare, real resources, and protection from exploitation—not by promoting the destruction of life as a substitute for justice.

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Elissa L.'s avatar

Furthermore, as of yesterday, Trump rescinded a policy requiring emergency rooms to provide life-saving care to women during pregnancy/child birth to save their lives (https://www.nytimes.com/2025/06/03/us/politics/trump-emergency-abortion-rule.html). Women will literally be left for dead and forced to die excruciatingly painful, preventable deaths. Pregnancy is now a death sentence for women, and we will be executed for the "crime" of having a complicated pregnancy. I know multiple women in my life who dreamed of being mothers, but now no longer see that as a possibility in this country because they don't want to die a painful and inhumane death.

On another point, it seems like to a certain extent, you're trying to defend figures like Walsh and Kirk. These men regularly make podcasts degrading and dehumanizing women, implying that we should be seen and not heard. It also seems like you support Harrison Butker, who told a class of graduating women that their accomplishments and degrees don't matter because their only true purpose in life to to be accessories to their husbands. If you truly believe in what these deeply misogynistic and problematic men promote, it doesn't seem like you honor your claim of believing that women are meant to be leaders, academics, promoters/creators of culture. Backing men who promote the trope of women being nothing more than pretty accessories doesn't lead to that conclusion. The fact that men like these (who have little to no idea about how the female body works, let alone any medical training) can decide whether a woman lives or dies does, indeed, show an incredibly troubling power dynamic, which is oppression.

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Elissa L.'s avatar

You gave multiple false and misleading statements about the Adriana Smith case. First, the fetus was 9 weeks old when Smith was declared braindead. That is not close to the point of viability. Second, the family explicitly indicated that they had no say in any of this, which they described in multiple interviews as a form of torture. The decision was completely made by the state, and the family is being forced to pay for all of the (very) expensive medical costs associated with this. You're trying to make it seem like the family and the woman had agency in making this decision when they absolutely did not. It was forced by the state because of these laws. Even if Smith expressly indicated that she did not want to continue the pregnancy, I am almost 100% sure that she would have been forced to be in the situation she is now in, just as teenage and child rape victims are now also forced to give birth against their will, putting THEIR lives in danger. You're trying to make this situation sound better by implying that women have agency and choice over their lives, while also advocating for that very sense of choice and agency to be completely removed from them. The two cannot be reconciled.

In one interview with the family: "Smith’s family, particularly her mother, April Newkirk, has expressed deep distress over the situation. They were not consulted before life support was initiated and have described the ordeal as emotionally and financially torturous." Respectfully, it appears that you're trying to "sanitize" this situation to make it appear more humane than it is. She is literally being used as a human incubator -- there is no denying that or beating around the bush. The dehumanization and objectification of women IS oppression. Adriana Smith IS being oppressed, abused, and tortured. And sadly there will be more Adriana Smiths. Respectfully, you cannot claim to be pro-life while supporting this.

On another note, you note that Catholic theology allows "medical interventions that may indirectly result in the child’s death". Medically, these medical interventions are classified as abortions and are treated as such under the law. A D&C is a common procedure used to remove fetal issue from the uterus after a miscarriage. That procedure, even if it is done after a miscarriage, is medically considered an abortion. In fact, a miscarriage is medically considered to be a spontaneous abortion. Because of abortion bans, many of these life-saving procedures are being banned, or there are extreme delays in care resulting in extreme pain, injury, and death in women. I can link countless examples of this. It seems like you feel as if your stance is morally justified because of this exception, however, this is clearly not what is happening in reality. Women cannot receive these medical interventions that may indirectly result in the child’s death, and they are dying.

Here are links to studies that show the correlation between abortion bans and a rise in maternal mortality:

University of Colorado Study: A study by the University of Colorado estimates a 24% increase in maternal deaths if the United States bans abortion federally.

propublica.org

Tulane University Research: Researchers found that states with higher scores on an abortion policy composite index had a 7% increase in total maternal mortality compared with states with lower scores. Specifically, states with a licensed physician requirement had a 51% higher total maternal mortality.

(sph.tulane.edu)

Commonwealth Fund Analysis: In 2020, maternal death rates were 62% higher in states with abortion restrictions (28.8 per 100,000 live births) compared to states with greater abortion access (17.8 per 100,000 live births).

(commonwealthfund.org)

Documented Cases of Preventable Deaths:

Amber Thurman (Georgia, 2022): Amber Thurman died of septic shock after a delayed dilation and curettage (D&C) procedure due to Georgia's restrictive abortion laws. The state's maternal mortality committee determined her death was preventable.

Josseli Barnica (Texas, 2021): At 17 weeks pregnant, Barnica was denied timely miscarriage care due to Texas's abortion ban. Doctors waited until the fetal heartbeat ceased before intervening, leading to her death from infection.

Nevaeh Crain (Texas, 2023): Eighteen-year-old Crain died of sepsis after two emergency rooms refused to treat her miscarriage, citing legal concerns under Texas's abortion laws.

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Brian's avatar

I told my dear friend years ago we should avoid Faustian bargains with princes of men. It’s reasonable to worry they will discard or distort pro life policies when it becomes politically expedient. Princes of men will insert their own image in place of our Lord and, like the morally corrupt Judges of the Old Testament, do what they see as right in their own eyes, and not what is right in the eyes of God. The Lord will hand us over to the consequences of our pride and rebellion until we repent and turn back to Him.

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Brian's avatar

Jesus, however, rejected these shortcuts. He rejected political messianism in all of its forms. He refused to play the economic, military, or magical messiah. Each time the disciples asked Jesus political questions, He gently corrected them.

We find ourselves faced continually with the same temptations Jesus faced, and looking at Church history it is evident that when Christians followed the way of Christ, which is to say, the way of the cross, God’s grace brought healing and consolation.

However, when Christians have rejected the cross, preferring instead triumphalism, spreading faith through politics and force, God has withdrawn His hand of protection and has allowed us to be chastised.

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Brian's avatar

Thus says the Lord: ‘Cursed is the man who trusts in man and makes flesh his strength, whose heart turns away from the Lord.” Jeremiah 17:5

Throughout the Gospels, the devil constantly tempts Jesus to seize easy and attractive forms of power and to accomplish with human force what God wants to achieve through peaceful means.

Just like St. Peter, many of us today think not as God does, but as human beings do, and prefer political solutions to our spiritual problems, justifying ourselves because we see human politics as a means to a just end.

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